Methylierung, RichvanK, welche NEMs/Vitalstoffe si ENGLISH ORIGIN

02.03.12 20:18 #1
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ANMERKUNG: INFO über das Übersetzungs-Projekt findet man hier: http://www.symptome.ch/vbboard/cfids...originals.html
AO


Eine Anmerkung vorab:

Im folgenden werde ich Infos posten, die zu einem großen Teil aus dem Forum Phoenixrising.me stammen, vor allem aus den Threads dieses Unterforums:
http://forums.phoenixrising.me/forum...ione-Chelation


Wer hier liest, dem fällt schnell auf, dass es häufig Diskussionen zwischen Rich van Konynenburg und jemandem Namens Freddd gibt, bei denen die Ansichten oft gegensätzlich sind.
RichvanK ist der Wissenschaftler, der in Anlehnung aus Forschungen und Behandlungen bei Autismus von Dr. Amy Yasko, die Hypothese zur teilweisen Störung des Methylierungszyklus bei CFIDS/ME adaptierte und weiterhin daran arbeitet.

Freddd ist selbst (heftig) von CFIDS/ME betroffen und hat wiederum das Behandlungsprotokoll von RichvanK für sich adaptiert und dadurch viele Erfahrungen gesammelt, anhand derer er nun engagiert andere Betroffene im Forum berät. Teilweise dosiert er wesentlich höher, von anderen Dingen rät er deutlich ab.

Ich versuche möglichst beide Seiten wieder zu geben. Ich denke, man kann von beiden viel lernen.

Gruß - tiga

Geändert von alibiorangerl (02.03.12 um 20:53 Uhr) Grund: Erläuterung

Methylierung,RichvanK,welche NEMs/Vitalstoffe si ENGLISH ORIG

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VORLAGE 1

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AO


March 30. 2011

SIMPLIFIED TREATMENT APPROACH
FOR LIFTING THE METHYLATION CYCLE BLOCK
IN CHRONIC FATIGUE SYNDROME—March 30, 2011 Revision
Rich Van Konynenburg. Ph.D.
(Based on the full treatment program
developed by Amy Yasko, Ph.D., N.D.
which is used primarily in treating autism [1])

SUPPLEMENTS

5. General Vitamin Neurological Health Formula [2]: Start with ¼ tablet and increase dosage as tolerated to 2 tablets daily
6. Hydroxy B12 Mega Drops [3]: 2 drops under the tongue daily
3. MethylMate B [4]: 3 drops under the tongue daily
7. Folinic acid [5]: ¼ capsule daily
8. Phosphatidyl Serine Complex [6]: 1 softgel capsule daily (or lecithin, see below)

All these supplements can be obtained from Holistic Heal - Supplements - Test Kits.
The fourth supplement comes in capsules that contain 800 mcg. It will be necessary to open the capsules, dump the powder onto a flat surface, and separate it into quarters using a knife to obtain the daily dose. The powder can be taken orally with water, with or without food.
These supplements can make some patients sleepy, so in those cases they take them at bedtime. In general, they can be taken at any time of day, with or without food.
Phosphatidyl serine can lower cortisol levels. Patients who already have low evening cortisol levels may wish to substitute lecithin [7] (at one softgel daily) for supplement number 5 above. Lecithin is also available from Holistic Heal - Supplements - Test Kits.
For those allergic to soy, lecithin from other sources is available.
GO SLOWLY. As the methylation cycle block is lifted, toxins are mobilized and processed by the body, and this can lead to an exacerbation of symptoms. IF THIS HAPPENS, try smaller doses, every other day. SLOWLY work up to the full dosages.
Although this treatment approach consists only of nonprescription nutritional supplements, a few patients have reported adverse effects while on it. Therefore, it is necessary that patients be supervised by physicians while receiving this treatment.

[1] Yasko, Amy, Autism, Pathways to Recovery, Neurological Research Institute, 2009, available from Holistic Heal - Supplements - Test Kits or Amazon.
[2] General Vitamin Neurological Health Formula is formulated and supplied by Holistic Health Consultants LLC.
[3] Hydroxy B12 Mega Drops is a liquid form of hydroxocobalamin (B12), supplied by Holistic Health Consultants. 2 drops is a dosage of 2,000 mcg.
[4] MethylMate B is a liquid form of (6s)-methyltetrahydrofolate supplied by Holistic Health Consultants, based on Extrafolate S, a trademark of Gnosis S.P.A. 3 drops is a dosage of 210 mcg.
[5] Folinic acid is 5-formyltetrahydrofolate. ¼ capsule is a dosage of 200 mcg.
[5] Phosphatidyl Serine Complex is a product of Vitamin Discount Center. 1 softgel is a dosage of 500 mg.
[7] Lecithin is a combination of phospholipids without phosphatidylserine. One softgel is a dosage of 1,200 mg.


(Anmerkung von mir: Über Phosphatidylserine wurde bereits diskutiert.
http://www.symptome.ch/vbboard/cfids...-besser-2.html
Bei niedrigem Cortisolspiegel / Adrenal Fatigue /Nebennierenschwäche besser auf Lecithin / Cholin / Phosphatidylcholin ausweichen.

Diskussionen zu verschiedenen B12-Formen, Folsäure als "Folinic acid / 5-Formyltetrahydrofolate" folgen)

Geändert von alibiorangerl (10.03.12 um 14:00 Uhr)

Methylierung,RichvanK,welche NEMs/Vitalstoffe si ENGLISH ORIG

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VORLAGE 2

ANMERKUNG: wird derzeit von tiga übersetzt!
AO


(Anmerkung:
Ich teile diese Info in 2 Abschnitte mit fetten Zahlen.
So könnten die Abschnitte zum Übersetzen aufgeteilt werden.


1
Hi Rich,

...Is there a specific reason you recommend the hydroxy b-12 in your simplified protocol vs. methyl b-12 or methyl/ad b-12 as used in Freddds protocol ? Also the Neurological Health formula contains 100 mcg of folic acid. Should we be looking for another multi that doesn't have folic acid in it (so far I think I have found one) or is the low amount of 100 mcg negligible ? xxx

Hi, xxx.

I think that it depends on a person's genetic makeup whether hydroxocobalamin or methylcobalamin will be more helpful.

In the full Yasko treatment, on which this simplified treatment is based, certain genetic polymorphisms (SNPs) are characterized, and the form of B12 used is based on the results.
In this simplified approach, no knowledge of SNPs is assumed.

Using hydroxocobalamin allows the cells to convert as much to methylcobalamin and adenosylcobalamin as they need, assuming that the intracellular B12 processing metabolism is operating normally.

This avoids overdriving the methylation cycle, and it also decreases the possibility of methylating inorganic mercury that may be in the body, and making it therefore easier to move into the brain.

Neither of these has been proven to be a problem, but neither has been well-studied. There is a theoretical basis for these concerns in the biochemistry, and I prefer to be cautious in the absence of more complete information.
It's possible that I am being overcautious, but I really do not want to cause people more problems than they already have.*

Another reason for continuing to recommend hydroxocobalamin is that the clinical study that Dr. Nathan and I conducted used this form.
I wish there was funding available to do comparative clinical testing of various versions of the methylation treatment, but so far that hasn't happened, and I think there is value in staying with a treatment that has some support from clinical testing that is supported by laboratory measurements, as our study was.

2
Yes, the Neurological Health formula does contain some folic acid.
My preference would be to eliminate folic acid, but this multi contains several other constituents that are directed toward supporting the methylation cycle and related pathways, which other multis do not have.

Based on our clinical study, the active forms of folate were apparently absorbed well enough when the total folic acid was higher than in this revised protocol, so I think this version should supply active folate at least as well, and probably better.

This revised protocol is again a compromise, as was its predecessor.
I can't say that it's optimum.
I know that Freddd has different views, and his ideas do seem to have merit for his case and the cases of some others.
Note that his approach is likely to be effective in a wider range of cases, including those with absolute, as opposed to functional, B12 deficiency, than only the case of a person with ME/CFS who has normal intracellular B12 processing metabolism, and a functional B12 deficiency, which is the focus of my treatment selection effort.

Freddd's treatment approach bypasses essentially all of the body's B12 absorption, transport and processing pathways. In this way, he is able to get the active, coenzyme forms of B12 directly into the cells, and that is clearly what is needed in Freddd's case and in some other cases in which parts of these pathways are dysfunctional for genetic reasons. My philosophy is to bypass only the parts that must be bypassed in a functional B12 deficiency, in order to preserve as much of the cell's normal control mechanisms as possible.*

Best regards,

Rich

Geändert von alibiorangerl (11.03.12 um 14:02 Uhr)

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VORLAGE 3 - Freddd`s Erfahrungen und Ansichten über verschiedene B12-Formen, einfache Folsäure, andere Kofaktoren ggf. etwas kürzen


As Rich mentions, a certain degree of caution is desireable.
I feel it is better to do the mb12 (B12 als Methylcobalamin ) and have the startup in a predictale manner, so that one is prepared to adjust to turning methylation on NOW, rather than some time unexpected in the next 6 months or not.

MY OPINION is that knowing it is going to start in 2-4 days and be prepared to titrate potassium then and there, knowing it is going to start, is far safer. How many people are going to carry potassium with them all the time waiting for the startup that may never happen or may happen at any unexpected time.

Further there is no evdidence at all that starting Hycbl (Hydroxycobalamin) before switching to mb12 (Methylcobalamin) /adb12 (B12 als Adenosylcobalamin) reduces either the intensity or suddenness of startup.
In fact everything points at the opposite, a more intense startup when it eventually does begin with more intense startup.

Again, if one wants to start up slowly, start with crumbs of mb12/adb12 and slowly increase, a technique that some have had success with. And by crumbs, I mean 1/20th of a 1mg tablet, a literal crumb. That ensures that things will start, and slowly, limited by the minimal dose, not by the unpredictable ineffectiveness of hycbl.

However, whether it is started slowly or quickly, it will start up in sections and even 10mcg may cause an unknown need for potassium, the same as an effective startup from hycbl. With the quantity of thousands of successful mb12 startups in which only very few people had serious startup low potassium problems and then only by ignorance of effects of potassium, the range is pretty well known.
I need 1800mg a day and that is with a diuretic that is NOT potassium sparing.

The hazard of low potassium is ignoring it, of calling it "detox" and not doing anything about it.
Recognizing it and that it means increasing ones daily total potassium intake by 20-40% is really no big deal. Ignoring it, and like ignoring many things, it is unpleasant and potentially dangerous.

I suspect that the anxiety over when it might start up by surprise spread over months and months is more problem than just knowing it is going to start in a few days and be prepared for it. I always took these startup effects as the SUCESS IS HERE flag. It signals healing has started.

That is one reason I am healed now and able to do this. I took all those things as indicating healing and followed the trail. The literature has warned about having induced deficiencies by taking only 1 or 2 vitamins for decades, used to scare people away from vitamins.
The warning applied to folic acid of course, to not start it without b12. However, cyanocbl is a worse excuse for b12 than folic acid is for folate and becasue of the poor effectiveness of both, probably limited order problems

I suppose a case can be made for leaving people in active b12 and paradoxical folate deficiencies for the rest of their lives so they don't have to deal with healing and being healthy and the things that happen.
Instead I will help identify these things and others as people find them.

One of the things that bothers me, and I may have seen a couple of examples so far, nothing concrete but certainly suggestive, are people for whom, no doubt in the 1/3 of those who are wrirte-offs with hycbl, that subacute combined degeneration is worsened by not having an effective mb12 startup before or concurrently with Methylfolate startup.
This only affects potentially an unknown percentage of the sickest, but it is also a very serious potential side effect.
ORDER OF STARTUP is important to prevent certain recognized problems.

So far we can recognize or suspect -

Recognize:
induced low potassium.
paradoxical folate deficiency from folic acid*
paradoxical folate deficiency from folinic acid and vegetable food source folate*
induced folate deficiency from NAC, glutathione and whey*
showstopper deficiency of vit D
showstopper deficiency of zinc
showstopper deficiency of SAM-e
showstopper deficiency of magnesium
showstopper deficiency of l-carnitine fumarate
worsened active b12 deficiency from hycbl
worsened active b12 deficiency from cyanocbl

Suspect:

Showstopper deficiency of Vitamin C, subclinical scurvy or worse.

paradoxical folate deficiency from folic acid - worsened or triggered Subacute combined degeneration*

paradoxical folate deficiency from folinic acid vegetable food source folate - worsened or triggered Subacute combined degeneration*

induced folate deficiency from NAC, glutathione and whey - worsened or triggered Subacute combined degeneration*

and in conjuction with methylfolate worsened or triggered Subacute combined degeneration induced by inadequate neurological activity of hycbl

and in conjuction with methylfolate worsened or triggered Subacute combined degeneration induced by inadequate neurological activity of cycbl
Freddd;

Methylierung,RichvanK,welche NEMs/Vitalstoffe si ENGLISH ORIG

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Vorlage 4 - bezieht sich auf Vorlage 3 -

Freddd
In your VORLAGE 3 you say "ORDER OF STARTUP is important to prevent certain recognized problems"

Q: what is order of start-up?

Are there any additional symptoms of potassium deficiency other than those posted in your opening post? Ive not experienced any of these .... yet other than constipation but I have IBS in any event so this is a constant for me, plus Im only in week 2. Are cramps a sign or is that more magnesium deficiency (btw, I dont have cramps either but am wondering if that would be on sign)?
Thanks XYZ

Hi XYZ

Something I've known for along time at sort of an unconscious level has grabbed my attention more lately. When methylfolate is started in the absence of sufficient mb12 in the CSF/CNS actual neurological damage can happen as SubAcute Combined Degeneration.

I don't know how much the CNS/CSF lack of transport affects things, so many unknowns, but hycbl might not get enough mb12 into the brain to protect it.

I would NOT start methylfolate before mb12.
I could even make a case for starting mb12 for a couple of days before adding the Metafolin.
This wasn't a matter of consideration when I started mb12.
Also, adb12 needs to be started before l-carnitine fumarate, and both of those before D-ribose.
Mb12 and Metafolin before SAM-e as these later things are dependent on the earlier. It might be helpful intead of the vitamin but not after the vitamin which might make it unnecessary.*

One of the things I noticed was how much worse reactions people had on foilinic acid and hycbl. (Anmerkung:Mit Folinic acid ist NICHT 5-MTHF/ 5-Methyltetrahydrofolate /Metafolin gemeint, sondern "Folinsäure", also Folsäure in Form von Formyltetrahydrofolate).
Now we know some of it is paradoxical folate deficiency but some of it looks awfull much like neurological problems from effective folate and ineffective b12 and it didn't happen with mb12 and folic acid or Metafolin.*

So that is really all I meant. Get the basics going first and the essentials and leave the critical cofactors for adding later depending upon what hasn't worked up to snuff.
Fred

Geändert von tiga (09.03.12 um 13:59 Uhr)

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VORLAGE 5 RichvanK zu B12 als Hydroxycobalamin, Kalium


„Hi, all.

I, too, want to encourage everyone to be careful about lowering potassium too much. I think that this issue is a good reason to go a little slower in restoring the methylation cycle function, and with it, the folate levels, which promote more rapid production of DNA and RNA, and hence more rapid cell proliferation and a greater demand for potassium.

I realize that Freddd's views about this are different, and I understand that he and some others are not able to benefit from use of hydroxocobalamin, but I just want to note again that for those who can use it (and about two-thirds of the people in our clinical study apparently were able to, because they benefited significantly), use of hydroxocobalamin allows the cells of the body to maintain control over how fast the methylation cycle and the folate metabolism recover, and thus this can take place more slowly. I think this will allow the body to adjust its potassium inventory in a more controlled way. For those who must use methylcobalamin, I think that using smaller dosages would be a way to keep the potassium levels more normal during the process of recovery.

In general, I have found that when dealing with a complex system, of which the human body is a prime example, it's not a good idea to make fast changes.

Best regards,

Rich

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VORLAGE 6 - Allgemeines zu low Potassium / Kaliummangel - schon fertig übersetzt, aber passt in die Reihenfolge


WARNING - LOW POTASSIUM IS DANGEROUS
When a person gets methylation going, even only partially, the single most dangerous side effect is dropping potassium. In the absence of kidney damage which people usually know about and certain drugs that cause the potassium to accumulate, low potassium is the odds on favorite after staerting methylation. As methylation starts up, no ifs ands or buts typically, in a day or less with the active protocol, when those symptoms hit on the 3rd day typically or a little later, it's virtually always potassium. This can get dangerous, how quickly is the only question. I have had enough disturbing communications in the past couple of weeks to issue this repeating the warnings.

From Pubmed -
Hypokalemia - PubMed Health
Hypokalemia

Potassium - low; Low blood potassium

Last reviewed: May 29, 2011.


Hypokalemia is a lower-than-normal amount of potassium in the blood.


Causes, incidence, and risk factors

Potassium is needed for cells, especially nerve and muscle cells, to function properly. You get potassium through food. The kidneys remove
potassium in the urine to keep a proper balance of the mineral in the body.

Hypokalemia is a metabolic disorder that occurs when the level of potassium in the blood drops too low.

Possible causes of hypokalemia include:
• Antibiotics (penicillin, nafcillin, carbenicillin, gentamicin, amphotericin B, foscarnet)
• Diarrhea (including the use of too many laxatives, which can cause diarrhea)
• Diseases that affect the kidneys' ability to retain potassium (Liddle syndrome, Cushing syndrome, hyperaldosteronism, Bartter syndrome, Fanconi syndrome)
• Diuretic medications, which can cause excess urination
• Eating disorders (such as bulimia)
• Eating large amounts of licorice or using products such as herbal teas and chewing tobaccos that contain licorice made with glycyrrhetinic acid (this substance is no longer used in licorice made in the United States)
• Magnesium deficiency
• Sweating
• Vomiting



Symptoms

A small drop in potassium usually doesn't cause symptoms. However, a big drop in the level can be life threatening.
Symptoms of hypokalemia include:
• Abnormal heart rhythms (dysrhythmias), especially in people with heart disease

• Constipation
• Fatigue
• Muscle damage (rhabdomyolysis)
• Muscle weakness or spasms
• Paralysis (which can include the lungs)


Signs and tests

Your health care provider will take a sample of your blood to check potassium levels.

Other tests might include:
• Arterial blood gas
• Basic or comprehensive metabolic panel
• Electrocardiogram (ECG)
• Blood tests to check glucose, magnesium, calcium, sodium, phosphorous, thyroxine, and aldosterone levels


Treatment

Mild hypokalemia can be treated by taking potassium supplements by mouth. Persons with more severe cases may need to get potassium through a vein (intravenously).

If you need to use diuretics, your doctor may switch you to a form that keeps potassium in the body (such as triamterene, amiloride, or spironolactone).

One type of hypokalemia that causes paralysis occurs when there is too much thyroid hormone in the blood (thyrotoxic periodic paralysis). Treatment lowers the thyroid hormone level, and raises the potassium level in the blood.


Expectations (prognosis)

Taking potassium supplements can usually correct the problem. In severe cases, without proper treatment a severe drop in potassium levels can lead to serious heart rhythm problems that can be fatal.


Complications

In severe cases, patients can develop paralysis that can be life threatening. Hypokalemia also can lead to dangerous irregular heartbeat. Over time, lack of potassium can lead to kidney damage (hypokalemic nephropathy).
Freddd;

-----------------------Übersetzung---------------------------



Warnung – zu wenig Kalium ist gefährlich

Wenn bei jemandem die Methylierung zu starten beginnt, wenn auch nur teilweise, ist der gefährlichste Nebeneffekt, dass Kalium sinkt.
Nierenschädigungen außen vor gelassen, wovon die Leute normalerweise wissen,
und verschiedene Medikamenten, die dazu führen, dass Kalium sich anlagert, ist die Wahrscheinlichkeit von Kaliummangel hoch, nachdem die Methylierung beginnt .

Wenn die Methylierung beginnt, typischerweise ohne wenn-und-aber, nach ungefähr einem Tag mit dem aktiven Protokoll, - also, wenn an typischerweise dem 3. Tag oder etwas später folgende Symptome zuschlagen – ist es offensichtlich immer Kalium.
Dies kann gefährlich werden. Es ist nur eine Frage der Zeit.
Ich hatte in den letzten paar Wochen genügend beunruhigenden Austausch, um diese Warnung wiederholt hier einfließen zu lassen.

Aus Pubmed ist folgendes entnommen:
Hypokalemia - PubMed Health

Hypokalemia:
Kalium – niedrig ; Niedriger Blutwert Kalium
Letzte Überprüfung: 29.05.2011


Hypokalemia ist ein kleiner als < Normalwert von Kalium im Blut

Ursachen, Indiziens und Risikofaktoren:
Kalium wird in den Zellen benötigt, vor allem Nerven- und Muskelzellen, um richtig zu funktionieren.
Kalium wird über die Nahrung aufgenommen.
Die Nieren führen überschüssiges Kalium in den Urin, um eine genaue Mineralien-Balance im Körper aufrecht zu halten.

Hypokalemia ist eine Stoffwechselstörung, die auftritt, wenn der Kaliumgehalt im Blut zu niedrig wird.

Mögliche weitere Ursachen für Hypokalemia:

- Antibiotika (penicillin, nafcillin, carbenicillin, gentamicin, amphotericin B, foscarnet)
- Durchfall (einschließlich dem übermäßigen Gebrauch von Laxanzien, die zu Durchfall führen können)
- Erkrankungen, die die Fähigkeit der Nieren einschränken Kalium zu „halten“ („Liddle Syndrome?“, Cushing Syndrom, Hyperaldosteronismus, Bartter Syndrom, Fanconi Syndrom)
- Diuretika / stark harntreibende Mittel
- Essstörungen (wie z.B. Bulimie)
- Der Verzehr großer Mengen (Anmerkung: Lakritz? Oder Süßholz? Weiß nicht, was er genau meint), oder der Gebrauch von Produkten wie Kautabak, die große Mengen ?Süßholz? Enthalten, die mit Glycyrrhetinsäure hergestellt wurden. (Diese Substanz wird bei Süßholz?, das in den USA hergestellt wurde nicht mehr verwendet).

- Magnesiummangel
- Schwitzen
- Erbrechen


Symptome:

Ein geringer Kaliummangel macht normalerweise keine Probleme.
Ein deutlicher Kaliummangel kann lebensbedrohlich sein.

Die Symptome einer Hypokalemia sind:

- Abnormaler Herzrhythmus (Herzrhythmusstörungen), insbesondere bei Personen mit Herzkrankheiten
- Verstopfung
- Müdigkeit
- Muskelschädigungen (Rhabdomloyse)
(Anmerkung: Unter*Rhabdomyolyse*versteht man in der Medizin die Auflösung quergestreifter Muskelfasern. Dazu gehören die*Skelettmuskulatur*sowie*Herzmuskulatur*und Zwerchfell. Rhabdomyolyse )
- Muskelschwäche oder Krämpfe
- Lähmungen (welche auch die Lungen betreffen können)


Zeichen und Tests:

Der Behandler nimmt eine Blutprobe, um den Kalium-Status zu checken.

Anderer Tests können beinhalten:

- Arterielle Blutgasanalyse
- Kleine oder große Stoffwechsel Untersuchung (Anmerkung: was genau gemeint ist, weiß ich nicht)
- Elektrokardiogramm / EKG
- Bltuntersuchung auf Glukose, Mangesium, Calcium, Natrium, Phosphor / Phosphat, Thyroxin (Anmerkung: Vermutlich sind Schilddrüsenwerte gemeint),
Aldosteron (Anmerkung: Aldosteron , Aldosteron | NetDoktor.de )

Behandlung:
Milde Hypokalemia kann durch die orale Einnahme von Kalium behandelt werden.
Ernsthaftere Fälle benötigen eventuell eine intravenöse Kaliumgabe.

Wenn Diuretika benötigt werden, kann der Behandler ggf. auf eine Variante umsteigen, die Kalium im Körper hält (Anmerkung: Es werden Beispielpräparate genannt).

Eine Art der Hypokalemia, die Lähmungen verursacht, tritt auf, wenn zu viele Schiddrüsenhormone im Blut zirkulieren (periodische thyreotoxische Lähmung).
Die Behandlung reduziert die Schilddrüsenhormone und erhöht die Kaliumwerte im Blut.

Aussichten:

Eine Kaliumeinnahme kann die Problematik normalerweise korrigieren.
In schweren Fällen, ohne ausreichende Behandlung, kann ein schwerer Kaliummangel zu ernsthaften Herzrhythmusstörungen mit fatalen Folgen führen.

Komplikationen:
In schweren Fällen können Patienten eine lebensbedrohliche Lähmung entwickeln.
Hypokalemia kann ebenso zu gefährlichen Herzrhythmusstörungen führen.
Im laufe der Zeit kann ein Kaliummangel zu Nierenschädigungen führen (Hypokalemische Nephropathie).
Freddd

(Anmerkung:
Wichtig - Kalium und Magnesium ergänzen sich
Die intensiven Forschungen in den letzten Jahrzehnten haben gezeigt, dass eine hohe Zufuhr der beiden
Mineralstoffe viele positive Wirkungen auf die Gesundheit des Menschen hat. Beide Mineralstoffe senken
den Blutdruck und beugen Herzrhythmusstörungen vor.
Eine gute Kaliumversorgung nützt nur dann, wenn gleichzeitig die Magnesiumversorgung gut ist, denn
Magnesium ist für den Transport von Kalium in die Zellen notwendig.
Siehe auch : http://www.nestmann.de/PDF/Artikel/KaliumMagnesium.pdf )

(Anmerkung:
Nachdem ich das 3. Mal die Metaflolindosis erhöht habe, begannen nach ca. 3 Wochen Hypokalemiasymptome bei mir (leichte innere Unruhe, Zittern, Herzrasen und Herzklopfen, ständig Hunger, phasenweise Verwirrtheit. Ich schob es auf meine Adrenal Fatigue - obwohl die gut im Griff zu sein scheint - weil mein Körper gerade ordentlich kämpfte. Dann stieß ich auf diesen Beitrag.. Versuche es nun mit Kalium. Kann es aber noch nicht beurteilen.

Anmerkung Johanna: Das Wort Hypoglykämie wurde durch Hypokalemia ersetzt.

Geändert von Johanna (23.02.14 um 22:02 Uhr) Grund: Hypoglykämie durch Hypokalemia ersetzt

Methylierung,RichvanK,welche NEMs/Vitalstoffe si ENGLISH ORIG

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VORLAGE 7 - Freddd`s Ansichten und Erfahrungen zu Kaliumwerten

In conversations with multiple people I have found a whole lot of other people who have low potassium symptoms and reactions at about the same level I do, about 4.2-4.3 . This they won't ever believe is low.

I've spent some time looking at the side effects of various forms of prescription b12, from Metanx to cyanocbl and hycbl injectables.
When they report side effects, by and large they are low portassium symptoms. However, they don't report them as low potassium.
They appear to be looking for levels below 3.5 before they would consider it as low potassium.

From side effects listed hypokalemia as a result of b12 of all forms is not any where near as rare as is reported.
As Rich would say, they are looking for an "absolute" low potassium by test results, not a functional low potassium by symptoms.

Also in my readings I have come across "low" potassium flag level varying from under 3.5 to 4.0. This is not safe. I don't know that this is at all based on "safe" or "non-sympotmatic" levels at all. If it is just mean plus/minus 2 standard deviations of people on their feet, that is even worse.* Freddd

Methylierung,RichvanK,welche NEMs/Vitalstoffe si ENGLISH ORIG

tiga ist offline
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Ich mach`mich jetzt mal über Vorlage 1 her.

Methylierung,RichvanK,welche NEMs/Vitalstoffe si ENGLISH ORIG

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VORLAGE 1 - Das vereinfachte Behandlungsprotokoll zur Anhebung des Methylierungyzyklus` - Überarbeitete Version März 2011


March 30. 2011

SIMPLIFIED TREATMENT APPROACH
FOR LIFTING THE METHYLATION CYCLE BLOCK
IN CHRONIC FATIGUE SYNDROME—March 30, 2011 Revision
Rich Van Konynenburg. Ph.D.
(Based on the full treatment program
developed by Amy Yasko, Ph.D., N.D.
which is used primarily in treating autism [1])

SUPPLEMENTS

1. General Vitamin Neurological Health Formula [2]: Start with ¼ tablet and increase dosage as tolerated to 2 tablets daily
2. Hydroxy B12 Mega Drops [3]: 2 drops under the tongue daily
3. MethylMate B [4]: 3 drops under the tongue daily
4. Folinic acid [5]: ¼ capsule daily
5. Phosphatidyl Serine Complex [6]: 1 softgel capsule daily (or lecithin, see below)

All these supplements can be obtained from Holistic Heal - Supplements - Test Kits.
The fourth supplement comes in capsules that contain 800 mcg. It will be necessary to open the capsules, dump the powder onto a flat surface, and separate it into quarters using a knife to obtain the daily dose. The powder can be taken orally with water, with or without food.
These supplements can make some patients sleepy, so in those cases they take them at bedtime. In general, they can be taken at any time of day, with or without food.
Phosphatidyl serine can lower cortisol levels. Patients who already have low evening cortisol levels may wish to substitute lecithin [7] (at one softgel daily) for supplement number 5 above. Lecithin is also available from Holistic Heal - Supplements - Test Kits.
For those allergic to soy, lecithin from other sources is available.
GO SLOWLY. As the methylation cycle block is lifted, toxins are mobilized and processed by the body, and this can lead to an exacerbation of symptoms. IF THIS HAPPENS, try smaller doses, every other day. SLOWLY work up to the full dosages.
Although this treatment approach consists only of nutritional supplements, a few patients have reported adverse effects while on it. Therefore, it is necessary that patients be supervised by physicians while receiving this treatment.

[1] Yasko, Amy, Autism, Pathways to Recovery, Neurological Research Institute, 2009, available from Holistic Heal - Supplements - Test Kits or Amazon.
[2] General Vitamin Neurological Health Formula is formulated and supplied by Holistic Health Consultants LLC.
[3] Hydroxy B12 Mega Drops is a liquid form of hydroxocobalamin (B12), supplied by Holistic Health Consultants. 2 drops is a dosage of 2,000 mcg.
[4] MethylMate B is a liquid form of (6s)-methyltetrahydrofolate supplied by Holistic Health Consultants, based on Extrafolate S, a trademark of Gnosis S.P.A. 3 drops is a dosage of 210 mcg.
[5] Folinic acid is 5-formyltetrahydrofolate. ¼ capsule is a dosage of 200 mcg.
[5] Phosphatidyl Serine Complex is a product of Vitamin Discount Center. 1 softgel is a dosage of 500 mg.
[7] Lecithin is a combination of phospholipids without phosphatidylserine. One softgel is a dosage of 1,200 mg.
-------------------------Übersetzung-------------------------------

30. März 2011


Vereinfachter Behandlungsplan zur Verbesserung des Methylierungszyklus` bei CFS/CFIDS/ME -
Überarbeitete Version vom 30. März 2011
Rich Van Konynenburg. Ph.D.


(Basierend auf dem vollen Behandlungsprogramm, entwickelt von Amy Yasko, Ph.D., N.D. , das primär zur Behandlung von Autismus eingesetzt wird [1] )


Nahrungsergänzungsmittel:

1. General Vitamin Neurological Health Formula [2]:
Beginne mit ¼ Tablette täglich und erhöhe die Dosis soweit verträglich auf 2 Tabletten täglich

2.Hydroxy B12 Mega Drops [3]: Täglich 2 Tropfen unter die Zunge

3. MethylMate B [4]: Täglich 3 Tropfen unter die Zunge

4. Folinic acid [5]: Täglich ¼ Kapsel

5. Phosphatidyl Serine Complex [6]: 1 Softgelkapsel täglich (oder Lecithin, siehe unten)



All diese NahrungsErgänzungsMittel können bezogen werden über Holistic Heal - Supplements - Test Kits.

Das 4. NEM ist in einer Kapsel, die 800mcg enthält.
Es ist also nötig, die Kapsel zu öffnen, das Pulver auf eine flache Unterlage zu schütten und es mit einem Messer in 4 Teile aufzuteilen um die tägliche Dosierung zu erhalten.
Das Pulver kann mit Wasser – mit oder ohne Essen eingenommen werden.

Diese NEMs können schläfrig machen, so dass sie in diesem Fall zur Bettzeit genommen werden.
Generell können sie zu jeder Tageszeit eingenommen werden. Mit oder ohne Essen.

Phosphatidyl serine kann den Cortisolspiegel verringern.
Bei Patienten, die schon einen geringen Cortisolspiegel am Abend haben, wäre die Substitution von Lecithin [7] (eine Softgelkapsel täglich) wünschenswert, anstelle von NEM Nr.5 oben.
Lecithin ist auch bei Holistic Heal - Supplements - Test Kits erhältlich.
Für diejenigen, die eine Sojaallergie haben ist Lecithin auch aus anderen Quellen erhältlich.

GEHE ES LANGSAM AN.
Wenn der Methylierungszyklus angehoben wird, werden Toxine / Gifte mobilisiert und vom Körper verarbeitet – und dies kann zu einer Verschlimmerung der Symptome führen.
WENN DIES PASSIERT, versuche es mit kleineren Dosierungen jeden 2. Tag.
Arbeite dich LANGSAM an die volle Dosierung heran.

Obwohl dieser Behandlungsplan nur auf rezeptfreien Nahrungsergänzungsmitteln beruht, haben manche Patienten von unerwünschten Wirkungen berichtet.
Daher ist es notwendig, dass Patienten während der Behandlung von einem Behandler betreut und beraten werden.


[1] - Yasko, Amy, Autism, Pathways to Recovery, Neurological Research Institute, 2009, erhältlich bei Holistic Heal - Supplements - Test Kits oder Amazon.

[2] General Vitamin Neurological Health Formula wird belifert und erarbeitet von Holistic Health
Consultants LLC.

[3] Hydroxy B12 Mega Drops ist eine flüssige Form von Hydroxocobalamin (B12), geliefert von Holistic Health Consultants. 2 Tropfen entspricht einer Dosierung von 2,000 mcg.

[4] MethylMate B ist eine flüssige Form von Folsäure in Form von (6s)-methyltetrahydrofolate ,
bereit gestellt von Holistic Health Consultants, basierend auf Extrafolate S, einer geschützten Marke der Gnosis S.P.A.
3 Tropfen entspricht einer Dosierung von 210 mcg.

[5] Folinic acid / diese Folsäure entspricht 5-formyltetrahydrofolate. ¼ Kapsel entspricht einer Dosierung von 200 mcg.

[6] Phosphatidyl Serine Complex ist ein Produkt von Vitamin Discount Center.
1 Softgelkapsel entspricht einer Dosierung von 500mg

[7] Lecithin ist eine Kombination aus Phospholipiden OHNE Phosphatidylserine.
1 Softgelkapsel entspricht einer Dosierung von 1,200mg.



(Anmerkungen von mir

zu 2. bzw. [3]:
Laut RichvanK können ca. 2/3 der CFIDS/ME Patienten Hydroxycobalamin umwandeln und verwerten. Alternativen folgen...
Hier werden Tropfen empfohlen, weil sie anwenderfreundlich sind.
Injektionen gehen natürlich auch. Wer Tropfen oder Lutschtabletten nehmen möchte, sollte sich über die Qualität vergewissern, da es hierbei wohl erhebliche Unterschiede gibt.


...Im Phoenixrsising.me Forum gibt es immer wieder Diskussionen um Folsäure in seiner einfachen Form, wie sie auch in NEM 1. enthalten ist.
Aktuell scheint RichvanK sich auch einen Multivitaminkomplex vergelichbarer Art zu wünschen, der frei von einfacher Folsäure ist.
Hier im Forum wurde z.B. hier schon darüber diskutiert:
http://www.symptome.ch/vbboard/cfids...-besser-2.html

Zudem gibt es im Phoenixrising.me Forum auch immer wieder Diskussionen um Folsäure in Form von NEM Nr.4 Folinic acid / 5-Formyltetrahydrofolate, da es sowohl Vorteile, als auch bei verschiedenen Personen Nachteile haben kann.
Dazu kommt später noch was...

Hier in #19 unten http://www.symptome.ch/vbboard/cfids...ursache-2.html habe ich geschrieben
„Folinic Acid / 5-Formyltetrahydrofolate / 5-MTHF ist die aktive Folsäure.“
DAS IST FALSCH! Folinic Acid / 5-FORMYLtetrahydrofolate sind identisch. Diese Form muss noch in mindestens 5 Stoffwechselschritten vom Körper umgewandelt werden und ist NICHT die freie Form.

Nur die Folsäure in Form von 5-MTHF / 5-METHYLtetrahydrofolate / Metafolin ist die freie, direkt verfügbare Form der Folsäure, die Körper nicht mehr umwandeln muss!!

Über Phosphatidylserine wurde bereits hier ab #13 diskutiert:
http://www.symptome.ch/vbboard/cfids...-besser-2.html
Bei niedrigem Cortisolspiegel / Adrenal Fatigue /Nebennierenschwäche also besser auf Lecithin / Cholin / Phosphatidylcholin ausweichen.
Hier ist auch bereits über Alternativen / verschiedene Lecithinquellen diskutiert worden:
http://www.symptome.ch/vbboard/oxida...mand-tipp.html)

Geändert von tiga (11.03.12 um 16:58 Uhr) Grund: Ergänzung Lecithinquellen


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